Open note to MS trainers, recruiters, and editors.
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When I see guidelines and a test that appears like it was written by a person with detailitus and it goes on and on and on and repeats, I figure the questions on the survey will be just as long and redundant.
Who will know, unless you have a digital recorder in your pocket, exactly, word for word, verbatim, what occurred during a sequence and what time and on and on over an hour at the location.
And when the scheduler says "it is and EASY SHOP" It will have too low a pay for something that is anything but easy. Cori has a University. If I am at that level I should be paid college graduate wages or be smart enough to avoid the shops.
Who will know, unless you have a digital recorder in your pocket, exactly, word for word, verbatim, what occurred during a sequence and what time and on and on over an hour at the location.
And when the scheduler says "it is and EASY SHOP" It will have too low a pay for something that is anything but easy. Cori has a University. If I am at that level I should be paid college graduate wages or be smart enough to avoid the shops.
I so agree. Yesterday I determined I would not shop for a company because of the confusing, threatening guidelines. I am interested in determining if others rule out companies on such a basis. Am I being overly picky?
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/15/2012 06:40PM by EddyLee.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/15/2012 06:40PM by EddyLee.
Here's another one to add to the list:
Don't ask compound questions which require a straight yes or no answer.
For example:
"Did the associate smile and say 'thank you'?" YES NO
This should be 2 questions. "Did the associate smile?" and a separate question: "Did the associate say thank you?" because some associates smile without saying thank you, and some associates say thank you without smiling. If you're going to force us into a YES or NO answer, than ask ONE question.
Don't ask compound questions which require a straight yes or no answer.
For example:
"Did the associate smile and say 'thank you'?" YES NO
This should be 2 questions. "Did the associate smile?" and a separate question: "Did the associate say thank you?" because some associates smile without saying thank you, and some associates say thank you without smiling. If you're going to force us into a YES or NO answer, than ask ONE question.
Oh, and I am totally in agreement about the threatening guidelines where they yell DON'T DO THIS! DON'T DO THAT! IF YOU DO, YOU WILL NOT - WE REPEAT - WILL NOT - GET PAID!!!!!!!!!!
Very condescending. I am not a child and I am not a dog and I don't appreciate being yelled at like I am one.
Very condescending. I am not a child and I am not a dog and I don't appreciate being yelled at like I am one.
Make that "recruiters". What a goof I made.
CheeChild Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Here's another one to add to the list:
>
> Don't ask compound questions which require a
> straight yes or no answer.
>
> For example:
>
> "Did the associate smile and say 'thank you'?"
> YES NO
>
> This should be 2 questions. "Did the associate
> smile?" and a separate question: "Did the
> associate say thank you?" because some associates
> smile without saying thank you, and some
> associates say thank you without smiling. If
> you're going to force us into a YES or NO answer,
> than ask ONE question.
Actually, for the above. It's just a compound question. The associate is required to do both in order to be scored yes. If you score a 'no', you simply need to narrate which item (or both) it was scored off for.
If they were 2 separate questions, it would probably be MORE work for the shopper.
-------------------------------------------------------
> Here's another one to add to the list:
>
> Don't ask compound questions which require a
> straight yes or no answer.
>
> For example:
>
> "Did the associate smile and say 'thank you'?"
> YES NO
>
> This should be 2 questions. "Did the associate
> smile?" and a separate question: "Did the
> associate say thank you?" because some associates
> smile without saying thank you, and some
> associates say thank you without smiling. If
> you're going to force us into a YES or NO answer,
> than ask ONE question.
Actually, for the above. It's just a compound question. The associate is required to do both in order to be scored yes. If you score a 'no', you simply need to narrate which item (or both) it was scored off for.
If they were 2 separate questions, it would probably be MORE work for the shopper.
I've had situations where there's no place for narrative.
I always wonder what the goal of these messengers. They must not be considering the thoughts and feelings of those who recieve their compositions.
Do Mystery shopping companies ever hire an Independent Contractor to evaluate the MS operation? If they believe in what they are doing it would seem to be a logical step.
EddyLee Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> As a retired school teacher I so wish that those
> designing training modules would remember some
> tried and true learning basics.
>
> 1. Provide ONLY positive examples of the way you
> want the job done. There is no benefit in showing
> prospective shoppers the wrong way to take a
> photo. Examples of incorrect reports does not
> teach a contractor to do the task correctly.
>
> 2. Do not detail negative punishments the company
> will levy if a job is not completed according to
> guidelines. Tell what is needed to receive
> payment.
>
> 3. When dealing with a contractor that did not
> follow your instructions speak of what is expected
> in order to successfully complete the task. No one
> seeks failure. Tell contractors how to succeed,
> avoid telling them what was wrong, just say what
> is needed in order to successfully complete the
> contract and receive payment.
>
> 4. Always test your tests. The number one reason I
> do not complete a training module is due to seeing
> tests that do not allow for clear cut, correct
> answers. The tests that are available are often
> weak in design. Have at least ten people complete
> the modules and carefully examine the design of
> questions that are missed by those testing your
> test.
>
> Contractors deserve respect. They are an essential
> part of the Mystery Shopping business.
I won't debate your expertise, as I'm sure you're much more experienced in this area than I am, but I kind of have to disagree with you on #1.
In a cut-and-dry process where there is a clear-cut correct answer, like a math problem, I agree that showing people the wrong way to do something may cause confusion. However, taking a photo is a very open-ended process. If the MSC has a good history of doing photo audits, I'm sure there are several common errors that have come up, specifically in regards to photos.
If you tell someone, "don't take the picture in dim light", it leaves the term "dim light" open to interpretation. By showing a right example and wrong example, it takes some of the ambiguity out of it and provides a clear picture of what the MSC expects.
Again, just my opinion.
-------------------------------------------------------
> As a retired school teacher I so wish that those
> designing training modules would remember some
> tried and true learning basics.
>
> 1. Provide ONLY positive examples of the way you
> want the job done. There is no benefit in showing
> prospective shoppers the wrong way to take a
> photo. Examples of incorrect reports does not
> teach a contractor to do the task correctly.
>
> 2. Do not detail negative punishments the company
> will levy if a job is not completed according to
> guidelines. Tell what is needed to receive
> payment.
>
> 3. When dealing with a contractor that did not
> follow your instructions speak of what is expected
> in order to successfully complete the task. No one
> seeks failure. Tell contractors how to succeed,
> avoid telling them what was wrong, just say what
> is needed in order to successfully complete the
> contract and receive payment.
>
> 4. Always test your tests. The number one reason I
> do not complete a training module is due to seeing
> tests that do not allow for clear cut, correct
> answers. The tests that are available are often
> weak in design. Have at least ten people complete
> the modules and carefully examine the design of
> questions that are missed by those testing your
> test.
>
> Contractors deserve respect. They are an essential
> part of the Mystery Shopping business.
I won't debate your expertise, as I'm sure you're much more experienced in this area than I am, but I kind of have to disagree with you on #1.
In a cut-and-dry process where there is a clear-cut correct answer, like a math problem, I agree that showing people the wrong way to do something may cause confusion. However, taking a photo is a very open-ended process. If the MSC has a good history of doing photo audits, I'm sure there are several common errors that have come up, specifically in regards to photos.
If you tell someone, "don't take the picture in dim light", it leaves the term "dim light" open to interpretation. By showing a right example and wrong example, it takes some of the ambiguity out of it and provides a clear picture of what the MSC expects.
Again, just my opinion.
I certainly understand your feelings on the photos. However, extensive research has consistantly shown that showing the wrong way increases the likelyhood of a person doing a task incorrectly. I will stick with the tried and true research.
I like seeing the wrong way, particularly on the pizza shops. I like to see what was rejected.
Gigi - Me too, me too. I like to see all the examples that shoppers thought were OK to submit, but were rejected. I get a lot of clarification from those "bad examples".
Eddylee - you certainly make valid points, and for the most part I agree with you.
Eddylee - you certainly make valid points, and for the most part I agree with you.
Mary Davis Nowell. Based close to Fort Worth. Shopping Interstate 20 east and west, Interstate 35 north and south.
Could people responding to a post avoid putting the entire post in their response? It takes a few more seconds away from my valuable time to scroll below them. Thanks.
That is typically done so that readers will know what their response is in reference to. That is the fun of this forum. It's like we are all in one big coctail party where the discussion is about random MS topics. What's a few extra seconds when you're among friends?
Sandra Sue Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Could people responding to a post avoid putting
> the entire post in their response? It takes a few
> more seconds away from my valuable time to scroll
> below them. Thanks.
Sandra Sue Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Could people responding to a post avoid putting
> the entire post in their response? It takes a few
> more seconds away from my valuable time to scroll
> below them. Thanks.
EddyLee Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Do Mystery shopping companies ever hire an
> Independent Contractor to evaluate the MS
> operation? If they believe in what they are doing
> it would seem to be a logical step.
THIS. I recommended this to one company when I decided I was done with them. Hypocrites!
-------------------------------------------------------
> Do Mystery shopping companies ever hire an
> Independent Contractor to evaluate the MS
> operation? If they believe in what they are doing
> it would seem to be a logical step.
THIS. I recommended this to one company when I decided I was done with them. Hypocrites!
As long as we are griping can we add not adding every single yes and no answer we gave in narrative form? And in the exact order? This leaves to disjointed and rote narratives that do not highlight weaknesses or reinforce strengths.
~~*~~*~~*~~ kal ~~*~~*~~*~~
Everyone has a photographic memory. Some just forget to load the film.
Everyone has a photographic memory. Some just forget to load the film.
Well stated. So much of the required narrative does not add any meaningful information. Requirements to spend time on the useless just lessens the opportunity of recruiting a skilled, experienced shopper. The good shoppers will often select the well designed report forms.
Sandra Sue, I'm kinda on your side with this one
I find quotes very convenient when the comment being replied to is on a different page or there have been many responses which are not always relevant. I don't understand quoting the post or multiple posts directly above a response, LOL!
I find quotes very convenient when the comment being replied to is on a different page or there have been many responses which are not always relevant. I don't understand quoting the post or multiple posts directly above a response, LOL!Equal rights for others does not mean fewer rights for you. It's not pie.
"I prefer someone who burns the flag and then wraps themselves up in the Constitution over someone who burns the Constitution and then wraps themselves up in the flag." -Molly Ivins
Never try to teach a pig to sing. It's a waste of your time and it really annoys the pig.
"I prefer someone who burns the flag and then wraps themselves up in the Constitution over someone who burns the Constitution and then wraps themselves up in the flag." -Molly Ivins
Never try to teach a pig to sing. It's a waste of your time and it really annoys the pig.
MDavisnowell Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Gigi - Me too, me too. I like to see all the
> examples that shoppers thought were OK to submit,
> but were rejected. I get a lot of clarification
> from those "bad examples".
>
> Eddylee - you certainly make valid points, and for
> the most part I agree with you.
They were probably rejected because they were acceptable and they did not wish to pay you.
-------------------------------------------------------
> Gigi - Me too, me too. I like to see all the
> examples that shoppers thought were OK to submit,
> but were rejected. I get a lot of clarification
> from those "bad examples".
>
> Eddylee - you certainly make valid points, and for
> the most part I agree with you.
They were probably rejected because they were acceptable and they did not wish to pay you.
PHD - I don't understand your post. None of my pictures have been rejected. I meant I like to see examples of rejected pictures in training modules, as I get clarification by seeing what was not acceptable.
Mary Davis Nowell. Based close to Fort Worth. Shopping Interstate 20 east and west, Interstate 35 north and south.
EddyLee Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> As a retired school teacher I so wish that those
> designing training modules would remember some
> tried and true learning basics.
>
> 1. Provide ONLY positive examples of the way you
> want the job done. There is no benefit in showing
> prospective shoppers the wrong way to take a
> photo. Examples of incorrect reports does not
> teach a contractor to do the task correctly.
>
> 2. Do not detail negative punishments the company
> will levy if a job is not completed according to
> guidelines. Tell what is needed to receive
> payment.
>
> 3. When dealing with a contractor that did not
> follow your instructions speak of what is expected
> in order to successfully complete the task. No one
> seeks failure. Tell contractors how to succeed,
> avoid telling them what was wrong, just say what
> is needed in order to successfully complete the
> contract and receive payment.
>
> 4. Always test your tests. The number one reason I
> do not complete a training module is due to seeing
> tests that do not allow for clear cut, correct
> answers. The tests that are available are often
> weak in design. Have at least ten people complete
> the modules and carefully examine the design of
> questions that are missed by those testing your
> test.
>
> Contractors deserve respect. They are an essential
> part of the Mystery Shopping business.
My professional development does not afford me the time to guess what I did wrong on a report. Constructive feedback allows me to see my errors promptly
and to correct them.
When I was in school my papers came back with red pencil marks on them and I knew what I did wrong. The result was that I learned. And no, I did not suffer from damaged self esteem and was not traumatized for life.
-------------------------------------------------------
> As a retired school teacher I so wish that those
> designing training modules would remember some
> tried and true learning basics.
>
> 1. Provide ONLY positive examples of the way you
> want the job done. There is no benefit in showing
> prospective shoppers the wrong way to take a
> photo. Examples of incorrect reports does not
> teach a contractor to do the task correctly.
>
> 2. Do not detail negative punishments the company
> will levy if a job is not completed according to
> guidelines. Tell what is needed to receive
> payment.
>
> 3. When dealing with a contractor that did not
> follow your instructions speak of what is expected
> in order to successfully complete the task. No one
> seeks failure. Tell contractors how to succeed,
> avoid telling them what was wrong, just say what
> is needed in order to successfully complete the
> contract and receive payment.
>
> 4. Always test your tests. The number one reason I
> do not complete a training module is due to seeing
> tests that do not allow for clear cut, correct
> answers. The tests that are available are often
> weak in design. Have at least ten people complete
> the modules and carefully examine the design of
> questions that are missed by those testing your
> test.
>
> Contractors deserve respect. They are an essential
> part of the Mystery Shopping business.
My professional development does not afford me the time to guess what I did wrong on a report. Constructive feedback allows me to see my errors promptly
and to correct them.
When I was in school my papers came back with red pencil marks on them and I knew what I did wrong. The result was that I learned. And no, I did not suffer from damaged self esteem and was not traumatized for life.
gigishopper Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> That is typically done so that readers will know
> what their response is in reference to. That is
> the fun of this forum. It's like we are all in one
> big coctail party where the discussion is about
> random MS topics. What's a few extra seconds when
> you're among friends?
>
>
> Sandra Sue Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Could people responding to a post avoid putting
> > the entire post in their response? It takes a
> few
> > more seconds away from my valuable time to
> scroll
> > below them. Thanks.
A few extra seconds is not important. What IS important though is, where are the cocktails?
-------------------------------------------------------
> That is typically done so that readers will know
> what their response is in reference to. That is
> the fun of this forum. It's like we are all in one
> big coctail party where the discussion is about
> random MS topics. What's a few extra seconds when
> you're among friends?
>
>
> Sandra Sue Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Could people responding to a post avoid putting
> > the entire post in their response? It takes a
> few
> > more seconds away from my valuable time to
> scroll
> > below them. Thanks.
A few extra seconds is not important. What IS important though is, where are the cocktails?
Virtual cocktails, coming right up! (As soon as I can figure out how to do it!!
gigishopper Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Virtual cocktails, coming right up! (As soon as I
> can figure out how to do it!!
I think I'm getting virtually drunk. If I don't stop, I may lose my virtuality. And yes, I do know when I have had virtually enough. If you keep serving me though you could be virtually liable if I'm in a virtual accident.
Virtually Yours,
Virgil
-------------------------------------------------------
> Virtual cocktails, coming right up! (As soon as I
> can figure out how to do it!!
I think I'm getting virtually drunk. If I don't stop, I may lose my virtuality. And yes, I do know when I have had virtually enough. If you keep serving me though you could be virtually liable if I'm in a virtual accident.
Virtually Yours,
Virgil
Dearest Virgil,
Im calling you a virtual cab. Only virtual water and sprite for the rest of the evening.
Your most virtuous virtual hostess,
Virginia
Im calling you a virtual cab. Only virtual water and sprite for the rest of the evening.
Your most virtuous virtual hostess,
Virginia
gigishopper Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Dearest Virgil,
>
> Im calling you a virtual cab. Only virtual water
> and sprite for the rest of the evening.
>
> Your most virtuous virtual hostess,
> Virginia
Virginia!
I'll bet you're a virtually very vivacious virtuoso from a valley in Virginia who is very vane and has varicose veins! And all the drinks you are going to serve me are now virgin.
Valiant Virgil visiting Vatican vats and vineyards
-------------------------------------------------------
> Dearest Virgil,
>
> Im calling you a virtual cab. Only virtual water
> and sprite for the rest of the evening.
>
> Your most virtuous virtual hostess,
> Virginia
Virginia!
I'll bet you're a virtually very vivacious virtuoso from a valley in Virginia who is very vane and has varicose veins! And all the drinks you are going to serve me are now virgin.
Valiant Virgil visiting Vatican vats and vineyards
ROTFLMAO! Happy St. Patrick's Day everyone!
Equal rights for others does not mean fewer rights for you. It's not pie.
"I prefer someone who burns the flag and then wraps themselves up in the Constitution over someone who burns the Constitution and then wraps themselves up in the flag." -Molly Ivins
Never try to teach a pig to sing. It's a waste of your time and it really annoys the pig.
"I prefer someone who burns the flag and then wraps themselves up in the Constitution over someone who burns the Constitution and then wraps themselves up in the flag." -Molly Ivins
Never try to teach a pig to sing. It's a waste of your time and it really annoys the pig.
Dearest Virgil,
No more bar shops for you!
Happy St. Patrick's Day!
Your vivacious friend,
Gigi
(Oh,dear! I must go find a shop at the vein treatment center, Virgil has seen my virtual varicose veins!)
No more bar shops for you!
Happy St. Patrick's Day!
Your vivacious friend,
Gigi
(Oh,dear! I must go find a shop at the vein treatment center, Virgil has seen my virtual varicose veins!)
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