I had the chance to take several shops that supposedly were to evaluate customer service. I decided to take only one of them since I knew I wouldn't get the paperwork until very close to shop time and to see what it was all about. The pay seemed pretty high for such a shop. Am I glad I didn't take more of these after finally reviewing the paperwork I realized this was a "Crash and Bash". That is my term for a competitor shop. I was being asked to "get them to say XYZ." or get written proof of them offering you XYZ. This had nothing to do with customer service this was a competitor trying to destroy a business. I don't know about you folks but I am here to help business improve not to try to bring down the competition. So I am a flake on this one and can walk away with my head held high.

I have no idea what kind of thing you are talking about. I never heard of "crash and bash" shops (by any name.) I have done many competitor shops, and they ALWAYS used the exact same form they rated their own stores with. Something seems off here.

How would it ruin a competitors business, exactly?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/15/2009 05:45AM by dee shops.

Usually a competitor shop is a legitimate evaluation. How does this shop you did differ from the norm?

Indeed my experience with the competitor shops is that they are evaluating the same characteristics that they expect of themselves. The major difference being that I don't need to have names or descriptions often on the competitor shops. One that I have done fairly frequently is with a grocery where you are to falsely complain about a spoiled product at customer service to see if they will offer to replace it, require you bring in the product and/or receipt or just one. They always have offered to replace and since that replacement would actually cost the competitor money, I usually 'forget' to pick up the item and claim it at the register. I figure no harm, no foul. If they told me to bring it in or bring the receipt, that gets reported. If they offered to replace they get credit for it. When the client does this at their own locations I have no compunction but just accept the product gracefully.

I am pretty disgusted that anyone would ever be proud of being a flake. If you didn't agree with the project terms after accepting it, you had the option to cancel.

I've shopped competitors of groceries and pharmacies. Neither has been objectionable. I'm not sure what XYZ could stand for that would contribute to the destruction of the competition. Could you elaborate?

I am confused too. What did they want you to try and get them to say, and how would it ruin the competition's business?

I enjoy competitor shops because I find them so easy. There is no specific "standard" but rather they want to see what level of customer service I get (no doubt compared to what they give), and it usually involves obtaining a price of something comparable to what they sell.

I just finished erasing my response to your questions. This is a very delicate situation. I probably should have never said anything in the first place. The reason I posted this message was to ask you not to go into every shop blindly. Our actions have consequences and sometimes they can be harmful. It may seem we are helping make a more competitive market place but what are the results of you coaxing an employee to make false statements about a product that they and another retailer both sell. What could a competitor possibly want with a recording of this type of interaction?? Maybe they are going to use it for training purposes. I'm really sorry to hurt all your feelings but I cant think of any good reason a company would need a recording of a competitor making false statements, especially when I was leading them into those false statements. I'm pretty sure I could take a young inexperienced employee right down that path and get them to agree the earth is flat but I'm not going to do that, not now, not ever.

Understood. I have never seen such a shop and would certainly have qualms about doing it. It does not even strike me as a contract a legitimate MSP would undertake. I won't even ask what company, much less what client. I even balk at the prospect of recording an apartment shop where the the client is shopping themselves. The only recordings I make are for my own reference.

Gill Scheduling Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I am pretty disgusted that anyone would ever be
> proud of being a flake. If you didn't agree with
> the project terms after accepting it, you had the
> option to cancel.


I'm in complete agreement here. As a shopper, I have never flaked on an assignment and I never intend to. As a newbie scheduler, I can only hope that my shoppers feel the same way....knock on wood LOL

Iowa, your post was one that raised questions that required answers to help us understand. Although you've not been able to answer these questions, I can appreciate the position you find yourself in. I've not seen a shop like this one though, and would want to guard against it, but the circumstances you provided are sketchy and don't give us the benefit of your experience.

Of course there is also that issue of disclosing too much detail with many MSPs is a violation of ICA. But certainly the notion of trapping a competitor into false claims and recording it sounds like the issue here and that kind of entrapment is what I think no legitimate MSP would/should be involved with. I would not participate in such a shop either.

I also would not participate, but I would cancel and tell the scheduler specifically why I am canceling. I have NEVER heard of any competitor shop like this. I wonder about the MSC itself, or if it was a speculative shop to get business for the MSC (which, with ethics such as those, won't be in business long, if so...) Finally, I wonder how thoroughly the instructions were read by the shopper. Something here is REALLY off.

I do recorded shops for MSC's both via Sassie and Prophet phone recording technologies, and having been sent recorders to use during a shop. One party recording is legal here, and I have no issues doing it. But something is off here, and without you telling us more, it is hard to say who or what is off. But something is.

I also question whether this truly was a competitor shop, or if it was a compliance or integrity shop. And finally, I wonder if it was not a vendor shopping a store to make sure that the store is ACCURATELY selling their products and their features, or if they discounting them outside of the terms of the contracts between the vendor and the store. A jewelery shop where you must bring an ad with a specific price quote written on it comes to mind...In that, the vendor is shopping the store selling their products for compliance to contract terms. This would only "ruin" someone's business if they were not keeping their side of their agreement with the company whose products they are selling. In my opinion, it is valid for the vendor to ensure compliance. How else will they know for certain kinds of products? For example, under agreements to accept Visa cards, you must take a purchase on that card, even if it is only a one cent purchase. The company taking that purchase will lose money, as the cost for them to put through a Visa transaction costs far more than that. Some stores will put a minimum purchase amount on CC purchases by posting it at the register. This is specifically forbidden in the terms of their contract with Visa, and Visa encourages consumers to let them know if their transactions have been refused for this reason. I might not think the set up is fair to the store, as they should not LOSE money on a sale. But, THEY signed up to take the card, and they need to adhere to the terms and conditions they agreed to...just as WE have to on our shops, and just as we expect the MSCs to do in issues such as paying us PER AGREED TERMS for our shops.

Nothing said here has convinced me the detriment to a competitor's business, and it appears nothing is going to be said to legitimize the claim, given the shoppers last posting.



Edited 4 time(s). Last edit at 03/15/2009 05:41AM by dee shops.

Flaking isn't professional and makes us all look bad, I agree with "nothing to be proud of" ... can't imagine an intentional "flake" - not the way to stay in the mystery shop business and be profitable!

UPDATE.

Contrary to popular belief I did contact the MSC before I "flaked" on this job and informed them of the problem. I have since received a email apologizing for this job ever being posted. The president of the MSC said in the email that they had not reviewed the guidelines completely before posting and if they had it never would have been put out. They have gone out of there way to make amends and in return I don't out them as a bad company for making this error in judgment. Seems like a fair trade to me.

Thanks for the update Iowashopper! I'm glad the MSC has acknowledged that their guidelines had not been reviewed. So I wonder just who the heck writes the guidelines? If I sent them a "job" to put assassins on the street would they just grab it and run with posting it? Aaargh!

Glad to hear it. I'm sure you feel validated.

I hope we have all learned a valuable lesson from this. I didn't start this thread by coming here to trash a MSC. I posted to warn other shoppers to watch out for suspect shops. In return I was vilified as "making all mystery shoppers look bad".
But thats ok I have very thick skin, I'm a mystery shopper, you have to be tough sometimes. I see posts all the time trashing MSC's and a lot of times its the shoppers own fault and they can't understand why the companies won't bend over backwards for them. I am glad I didnt come here and trash the MSC without giving them the chance to state there case. Maybe next time we can all take a deep breathe and not jump to conclusions. It's one thing to warn shoppers of suspect companies its another to just start slinging mud. So keep your eyes open because these shops may come up with another company, maybe one you do work for on a regular basis. Then its your turn to decide were that line is drawn for you. You will get to ask the question "am I gonna do this job to save my high shopper rating or am I gonna keep my self respect?". And after you decide be sure to come back here and tell us your decision so we can all throw mud at you. hehehehe.

Realize that it was you that announced you were a "Flake and proud of it". There was nothing in your posts prior to today's that indicated you had done anything except walk away from a job you felt was wrong. What you DID do was contact the company and let them know WHY you would not do the job. That is not a "Flake". I think we all are disturbed by "Flakes" and heaven knows there are enough of them out there that decide to just not do a job because it isn't convenient.

Maybe your definition of "flake" seriously differs than many of ours, Iowashopper. I understand that you feel we jumped on you, but it was you who stated you were a flake, you who stated you were proud to be one (under circumstances which you did not well describe,) and you who did not state, at least not until your second post, that you had not in fact "flaked", but had canceled the shop due to the written instructions, which bothered you enough that you did not find the contract tenable. You also did not talk about giving the MSC time to correct the situation, until much later.

If you had explained yourself better the first time, I think you would have seen a much different response. Many of us are sensitive to the TRUE flakes, but that does not describe what you did. Why would you want to label yourself with that when it doesn't fit?

Anyway, I am happy you were not a flake, and happy that the MSC resolved the situation.

WOW! This was a great exchange.

When I first started shopping I really didn't know some of the areas around me demographically as I only shopped and worked close to home. I am not proud to say that, although I attempted to shop this location when I arrived it was in a commercial area and was a seedy location, and did not go inside. I was totally not comfortable entering the location and I would have stuck out like a sore thumb. When I got back home to report what happened I was literally scolded by the scheduler. I apologized with a sincere reply and explanation but she wouldn't hear of it and responded to me in an unprofessional manner. I really did feel very badly as I pride myself to be reliable, accurate and dependable BUT there was no way I was walking in to this seedy location. As a woman alone I felt unsafe. Needless to say that wasn't good enough, I received a flake citation (the only ever!) and all job requests go unanswered. That was a year ago. I have since learned what areas to stay away from.

I also wrote another email explaining the mishap on my part to a different scheduler at the same MS company and it went unanswered.

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/21/2009 01:06PM by modario.

I'm sorry about your experience Modario. In this business there are schedulers and companies who make themselves doormats, ones that respond reasonably to reason and ones that just don't want to hear it. It is the same mix you run into in real life. I accepted a shop in a neighborhood where I only feel safe in the middle of the day and when I got onsite to do a shop there were a couple of drunks fighting it out. I cleared out fast and reported it to the company and cancelled the job. On the risk of recurrence, I don't take that location anymore and it lingers on their board most months. While the chances are good the situation would not repeat itself, I just figure the next time one drunk may be armed and unable to shoot straight. I certainly have no problems with this company still allowing me to self-select and do jobs for them and I bear no animus with the company because they have no control or knowledge of the sites they post.

Thanks, Flash. I'm sorry too. I have come a long way since then and have learned which parts of town to stay away from and the best part is now they actually list that shop as "Bi-lingual shopper needed". That location does tend to stay on their board for a long time.

I can't self assigned any shops from them but I know they have plenty of shoppers in my area to pick their shops because they go so quickly. Frankly, it's their loss as I have great relationships with many shopping companies and have done quite well.

Never too old to live and learn!

Yes, there are definitely companies that you build good working relationships with and those that are just ???? I figure that I have all the characteristics of an excellent shopper and the companies that make it too difficult to work with them lose. I have given only one company the boot, though there are a number that the pay needs to be much better than their normally posted fees to bother trying to work with them.

Yes, as soon as a company becomes more hassle for whatever reasons (poor communications, excruciating editors, etc., I just stop taking shops from them and never look back. If that company can't bother to see beyond one mistake after doing what you could to make it up, I would certainly put them on my "pigs might have to fly" list. :-)