So my sister told me an interesting story about an older guy who attends her church.
She has gotten to know him over the past months.
Apparently he has several adult kids. He has been divorced for many years.
He was low income and had child support payments he couldn't keep up with.
He fell behind and deeper in debt - so he dropped out of regular society.
For 20 years, he's been a caretaker on the property of a wealthy family - that's how
his housing costs are covered.
He is unbanked - he makes money through odd jobs, is paid in cash only
and he stashes it in hiding places around the property.
He hasn't filed a tax return for many years.
He lost his drivers license after he was found to be at fault in a car accident- so he has no ID
and doesn't plan to get one.
He failed to sign up for Medicare. Doesn't go to any doctors.
Says he hasn't applied for Social Security because it would
only be applied to his back child support debt.
His ex wife is dead, so his debts are to the state he lives in - not to her.
He has no car. He walks or rides a bike to the train...
He has a cellphone and physically goes every month to a local branch of the provider and pays cash
for the service.

Sister says he's been trying to get one of the women at church to date him and the woman refuses.

I find it very hard to imagine a completely cash lifestyle.

Complete cash life is actually rather common among Asian countries. While places have credit card it is uncommon and banks are very sticts on releasing cc to people. The requirement is also very high. The best most people would ever getting closed to a Visa or Master system is the bank's debit card.

It is actually not a bad thing because it really promotes the "Live by you mean" life style and people really have to calculate how much their balance before purchasing anything. If you want the newest Iphone? Check the bank's balance and make sure there's enough cash, or just plan ahead and save!

I have relatives in Lima, Peru and they tell the same - that this is not uncommon there....especially
among the large populations of indigenous that live in the mountain regions...one of my relatives
tells the story of the lady who traveled to Lima to buy a new truck for her farm...came time to pay
and she whipped fistfuls of cash from her pockets.

but in the US in 2025? I wonder how rare this is? with our tech driven society?

he told it does become a pain when he needs something and it can only be had online...he can't buy
anything online.

As well, during COVID, he wasn't eligible for relief payments because he's not on the books anywhere.

So he doesn't contribute, but he also doesn't take.

There is no way for him to get in debt with his method.

He also said when he goes out at night, he's sure to get back home not too late - he couldn't
produce an ID if asked by police.
Is it illegal to not have any sort of ID?

Is Peru where you would have dual citizenship BF? You mentioned DS in the past but didn’t say where.

How does a prince like that remain single?

@kisekinecro wrote:

Complete cash life is actually rather common among Asian countries. While places have credit card it is uncommon and banks are very sticts on releasing cc to people. The requirement is also very high. The best most people would ever getting closed to a Visa or Master system is the bank's debit card.

It is actually not a bad thing because it really promotes the "Live by you mean" life style and people really have to calculate how much their balance before purchasing anything. If you want the newest Iphone? Check the bank's balance and make sure there's enough cash, or just plan ahead and save!

I've been to an Asian - Polish wedding. At the reception it was red envelopes with cash, gold jewelry, and full bottles of Vodka and other liquor in the center of each table. All first or second gen immigrants as far as the people I knew.

What an interesting post.

“Off- grid” can take many forms.

I know some who are similarly “off grid” economically and say they are much happier.

The “debt-free” lifestyle doesn’t have to be inspired by hardship, and could be a very interesting way to transform an economy…

I’m sure I’ll get a lot of “push back” from some, but this isn’t intended to inspire argument, but is intended to stir the creative pot of possibility, introspection, retrospect, respect for those who inherit all of this, and all it could become…

We have many untapped gifts and it’s a rich person indeed who’s been able to create an abundant livelihood with theirs and maintain a clear conscience in an imperfect world…

So take a few moments, close your eyes, take a few deep breaths, try to relax, and Imagine life with no debt whatsoever… needs met, safe, everything paid for…and take a few more deep breaths, and really feel into it.

How much of our internal and ambient anxiety, broken marriages, friendships, business failures, and other conflict (including wars) could be avoided along with all the exorbitant accoutrements of maintaining the always expanding products, politicians, and weaponry over meeting universal needs? To borrow a phrase: instead of cutting education and food budgets how about making the weapons peddlers hold bake sales?

How much debt is created by hype, fear-mongering, envy and greed, rather than actual need?

What do we really NEED as opposed to “want?”

Is it ok to mortgage our futures (and future generations) for appearances and “wants” rather than needs?

How many “wants” we’ve becomed accustomed to, are actually expensively marketed as “needs?”

I wouldn’t advocate going “cold turkey” with the current debt addiction (except for the power monger-profit machines and their banking partners), because too many humans and others would probably starve and die of neglect unnecessarily before it could show the benefit … or simply not succeed due to the co-occurring “keeping up with the (whoever’s)” vanity addiction…

…but teaching people to live within their means or organically/ethically meet mission/purpose-driven goals without incurring debt could sure heal a lot of what’s going on in a world where the debt-peddlers seem to be at the top of the existing economic pyramid raising prices for our needs.

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/02/2025 11:10PM by SBP.

@SBP wrote:

What an interesting post.

“Off- grid” can take many forms.

I know some who are similarly “off grid” economically and say they are much happier.

The “debt-free” lifestyle doesn’t have to be inspired by hardship, and could be a very interesting way to transform an economy…

I’m sure I’ll get a lot of “push back” from some, but this isn’t intended to inspire argument, but is intended to stir the creative pot of possibility, introspection, retrospect, respect for those who inherit all of this, and all it could become…

We have many untapped gifts and it’s a rich person indeed who’s been able to create an abundant livelihood with theirs and maintain a clear conscience in an imperfect world…

So take a few moments, close your eyes, take a few deep breaths, try to relax, and Imagine life with no debt whatsoever… needs met, safe, everything paid for…and take a few more deep breaths, and really feel into it.

How much of our internal and ambient anxiety, broken marriages, friendships, business failures, and other conflict (including wars) could be avoided along with all the exorbitant accoutrements of maintaining the always expanding products, politicians, and weaponry over meeting universal needs? To borrow a phrase: instead of cutting education and food budgets how about making the weapons peddlers hold bake sales?

How much debt is created by hype, fear-mongering, envy and greed, rather than actual need?

What do we really NEED as opposed to “want?”

Is it ok to mortgage our futures (and future generations) for appearances and “wants” rather than needs?

How many “wants” we’ve becomed accustomed to, are actually expensively marketed as “needs?”

I wouldn’t advocate going “cold turkey” with the current debt addiction (except for the power monger-profit machines and their banking partners), because too many humans and others would probably starve and die of neglect unnecessarily before it could show the benefit … or simply not succeed due to the co-occurring “keeping up with the (whoever’s)” vanity addiction…

…but teaching people to live within their means or organically/ethically meet mission/purpose-driven goals without incurring debt could sure heal a lot of what’s going on in a world where the debt-peddlers seem to be at the top of the existing economic pyramid raising prices for our needs.

Debt isn't necessary a bad thing, but if you want to get into that realm you need to be very careful and know what you are getting into. And when I say complete cash life in Asia, it isn't 100% off grid neither. THere's still plenty of things that would required the help of debt, such as mortgage, and at times, auto loan. But one would not go get a brand new iphone with just a swipe of a card, or a monthly installment.

I've seen far too many people who get a brand new iphone like every year or two but never know the actural cost of those phone. They were just like "Oh I paid X amount per month along with my installment bill, and trade in my old phone for Y amount of credit", and that's the best thing they can ever split out. They have no clue how much they spent on their phone, how much they have lost by trading in their phone, and just kept on going into the never ending cycle, and then at the same time crying about their phone bill is too high.

Oh, just saw this Financial Audit episode and this is definitely a hot take

[www.youtube.com]

I read somewhere how the latest videos are starting to reveal many cracks and exploitations with various systems ...

@roboadvisor1 wrote:

I read somewhere how the latest videos are starting to reveal many cracks and exploitations with various systems ...

Did you write kinki’s post above?

Hi Minime,

No it's not Peru, although I do have relatives there.

I'd rather not say in the open forum here. In the past few months, I've withdrawn from writing as much about myself.
I do like the sharing here and enjoy learning about my forum friends here, but I've learned this forum doesn't have the same protections as other forums - the others do a decent job of weeding out haters, disruptors and those who only participate in order to stir trouble and harass others. It's really a security issue.

Maybe it takes more security tools or a bigger moderation staff than what we have here (shrugging I don't know)

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/03/2025 08:46AM by BarefootBliss.

SBP, you bring an interesting perspective.

There was a potluck at that church yesterday and I went with my sister and he sat with us so now I've met him.

He believes himself to be free and I can see that. He said the only time his lifestyle caused him great grief
was when COVID hit and his work dried up (he is a sound technician for live events).
In order to survive, he had to spend down his cash in order to eat and pay his minimal expenses.
When the COVID relief programs came about - he was ineligible since he is "off the books".
He went without work for over a year.
He says he doesn't visit food pantries or take any assistance. Says he is uncomfortable with all of it.

Interestingly, he mentioned the owner of property he lives on is also an older man, just turned 70.

I wonder what will happen if that man passes or sells the property - where will this man go live?
So, that's another thing - how does he show up to a county housing authority and ask for help when he has no data to produce his existence?
It's all interesting....you here all know that these are so called modern problems.
Years ago, the bureaucracy wasn't as layered in as it is now.

This sounds kinda like my uncle. He's in his later 60's now. Hasn't worked an "on the books" job for over 20 years. He was diagnosed with schizophrenia back in the 60s or 70s and there was so much stigma with it, he never was able to find a "regular" job.
He was a caretaker to my great grandma, then my grandma, and a few other seniors in the community. Most recently, he was caretaker for an amputee who passed away earlier this year. The family was wealthy, gave him a nice "birthday gift" and a letter of recommendation.
He was going to move in with my other uncle because he didn't qualify for social security or unemployment, but wound up finding another lady through his church who needs a caretaker. He lives in a heavily Polish area of Chicago and speaks Polish, so he's managed to find jobs like this over the years. I do not know how things will play out for him in the next 20 years or so, tbh, at some point, he may need his own caretaker.