Thanks @walesmaven. Very excellent points. Like I said. I use my device primarily for note taking. Record, pause, record, repeat as necessary. Since I do restaurant shops, I have no desire to record the entire experience as it would be too much work to search through a 90 minute meal to find the pertinent details.

I would still be interested in hearing how many service industry employees are required to sign a consent agreement to be recorded as a term of their employment.

PS., I just did two pizza shops today for a national chain, based here in Michigan. The phone call for ordering was recorded by the Sassie system. I hope that company has obtained all the necessary releases.

So lets see if I understand. Everyone that says it's a felony is providing factual information that has nothing to do with opinion or their personal interpretation of the law. Everyone else is expressing an opinion and 100% wrong?

Thanks for the free legal advice, is it illegal to provide legal advice if you're not a legally practicing attorney?

Isaiah,
For legal advice, please go to the sites that have links in the New Mystery Shoppers area. They are maintained by attorneys. That's why I cite them.

In real life I'm not particularly attached to my iPhone 6. However, when I'm doing a shop I look like I can't live without it--because I hold it in my hand (or set it on the counter) while it's recording the entire transaction. I turn on the voice recorder as I'm entering the store, then turn the screen off so it's blank.

It works like a charm everywhere but on cell phone shops, where I can't very well say I'm looking for a different phone when I already have one of the newest models!

@KathyG wrote:

In real life I'm not particularly attached to my iPhone 6. However, when I'm doing a shop I look like I can't live without it--because I hold it in my hand (or set it on the counter) while it's recording the entire transaction. I turn on the voice recorder as I'm entering the store, then turn the screen off so it's blank.

It works like a charm everywhere but on cell phone shops, where I can't very well say I'm looking for a different phone when I already have one of the newest models!

I too have an iPhone 6, and I am attached to it at home, on jobs, everywhere. I can put it away when I have to though! Would you be able to put your phone in airplane mode and stick it in your purse for cell phone shops--assuming that's legal where you are? I don't know if that would work, but it's a thought.

@walesmaven wrote:

Isaiah,
For legal advice, please go to the sites that have links in the New Mystery Shoppers area. They are maintained by attorneys. That's why I cite them.

Those are one of the first links I used after joining here. Then I focused on ones related to my state. The laws pretty much say any discussion that can be overheard by others outside the conversation is public, not private, thus not protected. My steak order, that the people sitting next to me can hear me ordering, is not a private conversation. The host at the podium greeting me is not a private conversation. My asking where the organic beans are located, in the middle of the aisle, is not a private conversation. There is no expectation of privacy in my situations. Unless or until I elect to use such a recording to prove something was or was not said, for the purpose of damaging someone, it's existence has no legal bearing one way or another.

My personal conclusion, in the context of our mystery shopping, there is no process by which a police officer could require I consent to be searched or otherwise hand over my cellphone just because a random citizen feels I might be secretly recording my surroundings.

Furthermore, lets say I'm in a restaurant and such an accusation is made. I'd make it very clear how ridiculous it is, then ask if the accuser or any of their staff are secretly audio recording our public conversation? I'd make sure that they understand everyone in the room is now under suspicion and subject to equal treatment. Of course that situation would never happen.

At the last cell phone store I stuck the (running) phone into my bra and proceeded as usual. I've tried putting it into my purse, but it didn't pick up half the conversation.

@pampet wrote:

@KathyG wrote:

In real life I'm not particularly attached to my iPhone 6. However, when I'm doing a shop I look like I can't live without it--because I hold it in my hand (or set it on the counter) while it's recording the entire transaction. I turn on the voice recorder as I'm entering the store, then turn the screen off so it's blank.

It works like a charm everywhere but on cell phone shops, where I can't very well say I'm looking for a different phone when I already have one of the newest models!

I too have an iPhone 6, and I am attached to it at home, on jobs, everywhere. I can put it away when I have to though! Would you be able to put your phone in airplane mode and stick it in your purse for cell phone shops--assuming that's legal where you are? I don't know if that would work, but it's a thought.

Isaiah,
What state are you in, please?

@KathyG wrote:

At the last cell phone store I stuck the (running) phone into my bra and proceeded as usual. ...my iPhone 6.

As a male shopper, I am still trying to picture someone hiding an iPhone 6 in a bra and it not being noticed. I guess some people have more hiding space than others.

Is that in an Otterbox case or the bare phone? (5.44 x 2.64 x 0.27 in)

It doesn't have to be hidden, scanman1 - lots of women use this area as a "2nd purse". No one thinks twice about seeing a phone there.

@walesmaven wrote:

Isaiah,
What state are you in, please?

Same as you, MD

Well, Isaiah,
The MD state law is so all inclusive that the legislature just had to amend it to permit law enforcement officers to use, in public, the audio capabilities of the video cams that they are being ordered to wear. I think you had better get better advice about how to interpret MD audio recording law.

ETA: My source for this is an interview of almost 20 minutes with the MD Attorney General on WAMU about 4 weeks ago. (Kojo Show).



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/25/2015 02:23PM by walesmaven.

Wales, methinks Isaiah has a mind like a steel trap...rusted shut and illegal in 37 states.

@walesmaven wrote:

Well, Isaiah,
The MD state law is so all inclusive that the legislature just had to amend it to permit law enforcement officers to use, in public, the audio capabilities of the video cams that they are being ordered to wear. I think you had better get better advice about how to interpret MD audio recording law.

ETA: My source for this is an interview of almost 20 minutes with the MD Attorney General on WAMU about 4 weeks ago. (Kojo Show).

The amendment is only there because the State is currently involved in a legal case where they are attempting to try a citizen that had a camera on his motorcycle helmet, whom was pulled over then held at gunpoint by an officer. Pretty much every Maryland lawyer commenting about this understands that the audio footage are protected by Maryland's decision to not include a privacy provision, like Mass and Illinois do have. The amendment is not necessary, but does support the current position that our police take (thus forcing the State Attorney General to argue) based on their internal interpretation of the law. It is like carrying a pocket knife, it is legal in Maryland, but if an officer tells you it is not, there isn't much you can do about it. A police officer can not violate a citizens rights, in any public area, by forcibly someone to see if they are somehow audio recording their surroundings using a hidden device. If makes no sense.

Maryland's law does include a privacy provision. That is, if the non-consenting party does not have a reasonable expectation of privacy with respect to the conversation that has been recorded, there is no violation of the law. State and federal courts across the country have determined that there is no reasonable expectation of privacy in public spaces. This is why someone can snap your photo in public without your consent.

The no reasonable expectation of privacy provision pertains only to video as far as the legal advice that the MSCs are getting is concerned.

@walesmaven wrote:

The no reasonable expectation of privacy provision pertains only to video as far as the legal advice that the MSCs are getting is concerned.

I understand and agree with where the MSCs are coming from.

Then don't audio record when acting as their agent.

@isaiah58 wrote:

Experiment on your own. I use an app on my phone but if I answer a call it interrupts the microphone. I have to put the phone in a shirt pocket, or hold it. If I put it in a case, on my side, it muffles the sound.

Just turn a tv on and see how well your device picks up sound. Talk normally, test it. Ask a relative or friend to help test it.

It's best to put your phone in airplane mode when recording so you don't have to be concerned with phone calls turning off the microphone.

@KathyG wrote:

In real life I'm not particularly attached to my iPhone 6. However, when I'm doing a shop I look like I can't live without it--because I hold it in my hand (or set it on the counter) while it's recording the entire transaction. I turn on the voice recorder as I'm entering the store, then turn the screen off so it's blank.

It works like a charm everywhere but on cell phone shops, where I can't very well say I'm looking for a different phone when I already have one of the newest models!

I also have an iPhone 6 and I do the same thing, although I often put the phone in an outside pocket of a purse. Today so many people have a phone in their hand so it's easy to blend in when you need to have it in your hand to do your shops. I purposely buy purses with outside pockets now! I am in a one party state and I record everything with my phone. I can't trust myself to remember or even calculate things like the exact number of seconds before I get assistance. I wouldn't do mystery shopping if I couldn't record a lot of shops.

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/26/2015 07:45AM by nycrocks.

I do just fine using the memo app on my phone to record timings. I used to speak them into the phone, bu that ended up wasting time listening to or transcribing my comments.

Download a voice recorder app on your phone, then put it in airplane mode (so you won't get any calls) and put the phone in your shirt pocket or an outside pocket of your purse. Works great every time!



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/27/2015 01:38AM by kathierost.

Most shops clearly state that you are not allowed to record the shop. So in addition to the issue of the State Law, understand if the MSC ever finds out you are recording, you will be removed from their database. I do lots of apartment shops so I do understand about the problem with getting what the person said and remembering it word for word. LOL I am so busy trying to remember what the person was wearing, color of hair, hairstyle and LOVE THIS ONE- COLOR OF EYES! I am not planning to date the person, but you would think so from the info they expect. My favorite is : What is the agent's weight???? I usually answer that with I HAVE NO IDEA. Or the details of the apartment - color of carpet, countertops, cabinets, etc. etc!

I use the free voice recorder app on my cellphone. Since we live in an age where everyone has a cellphone glued to the palm of their hand or stuck to their ear, talking into your phone discreetly is not even questionable. I have the app ready to go and talk to it with my notes as I walk down aisles in the store. I repeat verbatim what was said and the name of the person who said it. I do this several times during my shop. I play them back when I do my report. Now, this may not work for all situations, but it is certainly legal and I don't have to rely on my memory or write things down in the car. By then, I have already forgotten half of what was said anyway. Works especially well for those grocery shops since you need the first name of each person you interacted with in each department.

FYI: Alot of the pre-installed voice recorders will stop your recording if you're trying to multi-task with your phone while recording.

Because of that, I prefer to use the "Easy Voice Recorder" app for Android. It records in .wav, so prepare for a large file, especially if your total recording is over an hour (thank God for an S3 with microSD card slot). Also, "Easy Voice Recorder" will display your end time, but you must calculate the start time of your file. Since I have A.D.D., time calculations aren't my speciality, so I use this website: [www.calculator.net]

Far easier than trying to remember everything, at least it is for me.

Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 08/29/2015 04:05AM by timgordon2448.

In Washington State..
"..the state Supreme Court has held that the presence of another person during a conversation generally means the matter is not secret or confidential such that it would qualify as private. Washington v. Clark, 916 P.2d 384 (Wash. 1996). Thus, a journalist does not need consent to record conversations in public where there is no reasonable expectation of privacy."

I have used my smartphone and have found this to work quite well. The flash drive recorders depending on what pocket you put them in work quite well also. I have found out that do not put them in your front pocket on your pants or shorts for you hear the rustle of the clothing. And don't let anyone know that you are recording them for they will show you off of the shop also and in some cases dismiss you from the mystery shopping company 4 unless you have been approved 4 shots of this nature you have violated your terms of agreement

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/29/2015 11:22AM by bmttinman.

daveclark5,

If i am sitting in a leasing agent's office and touring an apartment, that's not exactly "in public". I am on private property, in a private office. I can see where that would be acceptable in a retail setting; in this one, not so much.

True. Therefore using one would be at your own risk under those circumstances. Fortunately we're all Independent Contractors (except in Nevada) and can take our chances, as it were.

I am not an attorney, but the way I read the law on recording phone calls and conversations, it is legal as long as one party knows about the recording. You are the party that knows. This is in TN. If it is your recording and you don't share it or publish it, who would know anyway? I always record. It has a better memory than my own...haha. I like the recorder on my Samsung Galaxy 5. It also has a timer on it. This helps with those not so easy covert timings.

jthardin,

You are in what's known as a 'one-party' state. Others, including WA, are 'two-party' states - both parties must know about and agree to the recording. Thus the discussion about public vs private settings.

For the details in an apt shop, such as eye color, etc., it's perfectly acceptable to answer 'unknown'. For height, weight, age, close counts. An easy way for me is to compare the height, weight, age, hair, to me. It's easier to remember if she's a bit taller than me over trying to remember 5'6". The more you do, the easier it gets and the more details you'll remember.