I do luxury hotel mystery shops. I love them. I try to keep two minds when doing them: be personally humble, polite and gracious that I get to stay in wonderful places for free, but also try to remember that the kind of people who can plop down mega bucks for a vacation tend to be very needy and expect a lot of service.

So I got sent out to review a hotel out in the Hamptons: one night cost me $525. The "hotel" is in a converted summer camp, touted on their website as having grills. So when I gotta call up the hotel before my stay and ask questions, I ask if the grills are gas or charcoal, and if fuel is provided. I was told charcoal was provided so, hey, great, toss some franks and some ground beef into my suitcase and prepare to grill when I get there.

Turns out they don't have charcoal though. Okay, no big deal. I'm told by the person checking me in that I can rent a bike from the hotel and go to the nearest supermarket and buy some. And here's where the two mentalities in my brain start to come into conflict.

I'm a healthy young man who wouldn't have an issue biking on a beautiful clear day in the Hamptons, though it would take me a half hour or 45 minutes I planned to spend relaxing.

If I pretend I'm a more typical guest at a luxury hotel though: should I expect them to offer to have someone go GET me charcoal? Again, I'm dropping $525 a night, you'd think they'd be bending over backwards for me, right?

So when it comes time to say whether or not the hotel "owned and executed" my requests and "proactively offered assistance", what should I say, yes or no? Mentality 1 says yes, mentality 2 says no. I'm opening it up to you guys to see what you'd say.

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/23/2015 04:44AM by Misanthrope.

I'm not sure where you get the notion the typical guest is "needy." When paying for products and/or services anyone should expect to receive an appropriate value. Personally, it wouldn't matter if I was paying $50 or $5,000. If I was told something would be available the proffered solution of the hotel can "rent" me a bike to pick it up myself is unacceptable. You were told the charcoal was included. Now they want you not just to spend your leisure time, but also to buy the charcoal AND pay them to use one of their bicycles? The proper response would have been for them to send someone to the store.

I'm going to go with no. If they know they have charcoal grills on the property, there needs to be some bloody charcoal around there somewhere. I know your actual mentality is that you're working and wouldn't mind running a quick errand related to the job, but you're also playing the part of someone who's on a relaxing vacation. The establishment should be prepared to take care of those things for their guests.

If your request had been for an outdoor cardio workout, then they would have been owning and executing by offering to rent you a bike. Later, if they had seen that your bike ride was going too easily for you, and if they had taken the initiative to drive up alongside of you and plunk a 40 lb. bag of charcoal into your lap and speed away so that you would have to work harder to make it back to the hotel, thereby increasing the benefits of your outdoor cardio workout, then they would have been proactively offering assistance.

But if your request had been to grill.... not so much.

One of my very first jobs was working at a resort. My job was to help with boat rentals. We sent people down the river in canoes, kayaks, and inflatable rafts, then picked them up a few miles down the road.

I've always remembered the training they gave me before I was allowed to interact with the customer. It was very serious training, and surprisingly effective.

One acronym particularly stands out in my memory: HEART. This is for when a customer has any complaint at all -- no matter how small.

Hear, Empathize, Apologize, Resolve, and Thank.

Employees should be listening very closely, trying to understand their customers needs, working hard to meet those needs, and thanking the customer for any help the customer offers. And yes, a customer is helping when they ask for something or complain!

I urge you to think of this from a third perspective. Not from the perspective of a typical guest, not from the perspective of a grateful guest, but from the perspective of the management that hired you. From their perspective, I think the answer is clear.

That brainwashing/training I got, way back when, really stuck with me

Take a second look at the evaluation form and that should calm your quandry. Chances are there were questions pertaining to the resort staff meeting your needs and expectations with a certain attitude.

You also have to keep in mind the location, and the experience they are attempting to provide for the guests. You are at a "Summer camp" in the Hamptons. Are other guests going to be put off by riding a bike to the store?

I once evaluated a dude ranch that was way over $500 night. They had me working with livestock that provided food for the restaurant, and sent me out to a greenhouse to pick my own tomatoes for my meal. Should I have been concerned that guests were not being coddled?

It's not our job as mystery shoppers to draw conclusions regarding how appropriate staff behavior is. You report on it objectively and let the hotel management decide what is appropriate.

Regarding the standards; Proactively offering assistance would be filled by the staff telling you that you can take a bike to the store when you asked for charcoal and there was none. If you had to prompt them for ways to attain a bag of charcoal, then they would have failed that standard. Whenever I spoke with hotel managers about scores for hotels, they would always want the "Spirit" of the standards upheld. In this case, did the staff make an attempt to help you before you demanded assistance?

You would think at $525 a night, that the bike rental would be free too.

Or you could rephrase the question... How much should I expect from a "Camp" that has charcoal grills?

I think that if they told you that charcoal was available, then it is on them to make it available. If you had not asked in advance, then providing you with a bike would be a step in the right direction.

...and isn't that why the hotel sends in shoppers?...So that they can make sure that PAYING guests are getting the right info when they call in?

You report that you received incorrect information when calling in, and then how the problem was resolved at the hotel. Then you can feel good about making a difference in the experience for future guests.

Feeling poorly about how you were treated when you are spending over $500 per night of money that actually comes from the packet of the person reading your report seems a bit misdirected to me. Be objective and let them feel angry about the way guests are treated...

I'd love to be objective if the question was objective. Whether or not a hotel associate "fully owned and executed" a request seems, to me, to be asking me a subjective question to begin with.

I didn't necessarily interpret it as Misanthrope being angry or even necessarily disappointed. Though I don't think I could blame him for being disappointed. If, as is the case with many hotel stays, the cash payment is not in line with the amount of work required and the shopper is understood to gain some benefit from the hotel experience then it's understandable to be disappointed if you came in thinking you would receive a stay worthy of the price tag but the experience falls short.

After the recent discussion on MS earnings, particularly when it comes to the value of reimbursed items, I've been reconsidering how I think about reimbursement type shops. If a resort has a price tag of $1,000 a night, is that necessarily how I should value my visit? Even if I wouldn't have considered spending my own money to stay? And even if there were a similar type property at half the price nearby? Etc...

All of that is probably off topic and needs its own thread, but if I were in the OP's shoes and expected to receive $550 in value but really received a glorified camping experience that I could have reproduced on my own for under $50, I think I would feel that I didn't receive the level of compensation for my time that had been expected going in.

@Misanthrope wrote:

I'd love to be objective if the question was objective. Whether or not a hotel associate "fully owned and executed" a request seems, to me, to be asking me a subjective question to begin with.

If you told them that there had been a promise of charcoal being provided and they made you go get your own, it seems clear that your request was not "fully owned and executed".

@saacman5033 wrote:

I didn't necessarily interpret it as Misanthrope being angry or even necessarily disappointed. Though I don't think I could blame him for being disappointed. If, as is the case with many hotel stays, the cash payment is not in line with the amount of work required and the shopper is understood to gain some benefit from the hotel experience then it's understandable to be disappointed if you came in thinking you would receive a stay worthy of the price tag but the experience falls short.

After the recent discussion on MS earnings, particularly when it comes to the value of reimbursed items, I've been reconsidering how I think about reimbursement type shops. If a resort has a price tag of $1,000 a night, is that necessarily how I should value my visit? Even if I wouldn't have considered spending my own money to stay? And even if there were a similar type property at half the price nearby? Etc...

All of that is probably off topic and needs its own thread, but if I were in the OP's shoes and expected to receive $550 in value but really received a glorified camping experience that I could have reproduced on my own for under $50, I think I would feel that I didn't receive the level of compensation for my time that had been expected going in.

I'm not angry, and overall I did enjoy myself. As I said, the humble mentality I tend to adopt really wasn't bothered by the fact I had to bike to get charcoal, at most I was mildly perturbed. But I was wondering if the typical guest of a place that paid that much for a hotel has the expectation that if they need something to use one of the hotel's amenities, it be brought to them?

Let's pretend this hotel had a pool, but no towels. Would it be reasonable to expect the hotel to offer to get me towels if I didn't bring them? Or if the hotel had a, I don't know, tennis court, would it be reasonable to expect them to get me balls and a racquet? I mean, it's odd to me that the hotel had grills to begin with but no charcoal.

I think the main point is that you were informed there was charcoal available but when you got to the resort it was not. If I had been informed that to get charcoal you take a ride on a rental bike (at your expense) and buy your own that would be a different story. So I do not feel the resort was being fully informed when you made the phone call and that would be a ding on the report.

@Misanthrope wrote:

I'd love to be objective if the question was objective. Whether or not a hotel associate "fully owned and executed" a request seems, to me, to be asking me a subjective question to begin with.

I think there is an objective way to report on that. You may be missing some of the required information to make that judgement, however.

The standard doesn't ask your opinion on if your request was fully owned, and the spirit of it would be if the employee did everything in their power to make the request happen. If the hotel staff had the capacity to provide charcoal and simply chose not to, or directed you to another staff member for assistance, that would be not owning the request. If they are somehow prohibited from providing by it safety standards, or it it against company policy to purchase certain items for guest consumption, then it would be out of their hands.

Myself, I would probably give a 'no' to the standard and say that you were sent to retrieve charcoal on your own. That's objective. It's then up to the MSC to to change the scoring if the client offers evidence about not being able to provide it, since providing you a bike and directing you to the store may have been the best they were capable of.

As an editor, I was regularly contacted by hotel managers to change scores when things were graded down, but out of their control. I remember a case of a shopper taking points off for the front desk not being willing to give them aspirin, yet hotel policy forbid employees from dispensing any type of medicine. Shoppers may have no way of knowing those types of this, however. You simply do your best to report it objectively and it will get adjusted later if neccesary.

I would add that the title of this thread is subjective.

@Misanthrope wrote:

How much service should I expect from a hotel that's over $500 a night?

That's the basis of my feeling that you were not being objective. You are basing the amount of service expected on the price point of the hotel stay. The price is irrelevant in the face of the standard we are discussing. If the question existed on a hotel stay that cost $50 it should be graded the same.

If they asked your opinion on the value of the stay (a question I often see), then it's appropriate to include a subjective option that takes the cost into account.

I would have done two things: (1) Went on a hotel review site and found out how the guests were really treated "before" I accepted the shop. (2) I would have also went on the main hotel site and read all that was included.

I would have told the front desk that I was not going to ride a bike and strap a 40 lb bag of charcoal on my back. Ask her if she can spell G-U-E-S-T_ S-E-R-V-I-C-E-S. Tell her: "The last thing I want to when I stay at a hotel is WORK!"

Perhaps to a fault, I often think over the whole experience and try to find ways to give the employees the point... Unless I was so badly treated/ignored.

This may be a fun activity for us but this is somebody's job and livelihood.

I am on the side of those who think you should not expect anything out of the ordinary. Since you asked and received an answer that charcoal was provided then for your stay, this was not out of the ordinary. If the person answering the phone assured you charcoal was provided then you should be expecting that no0 matter the price of the hotel. The issue for me is how this discrepancy was handled. Had the person you spoke with recognized your statement that you were told charcoal was provided? If they did recognize your statement and in someway answered that then I would say they did what they should. If they said something along the lines that they do not provide charcoal and mentioned that they would do something to retrain staff on this issue and apologized and perhaps threw something in for you...a free bike for a day perhaps or a free breakfast the next day or even some briquets from the hotel stash then they tried to remedy the situation. If they ignored your statement and just suggested renting a bike without apologizing and trying in some way to fix it then I would give them a no. I would not expect them to ride a bike into town themselves to get charcoal just for you if someone told you they had it but I would expect something even if just words of sorry. Do they lock the cars up while at this camp?

Personally, I think the hotel missed an opportunity to "Own and execute." They could have offered to go and get some charcoal for you. At the very least, keeping some on hand for guests would be a great service. Offering to drive you to the closest store would also have been a great way to deliver a memorable service.

There should be charcoal and somehow or something to light it with. Also they should have a varity of items that you can cook on the grill. Sorry, I think they fell short on this question.

Report the truth. They did not meet your needs. You were inconvenienced and told something by the reservationist that didn't wind up to be true. Put names and dates in the report. Tell it exactly like it is. I do high end hotels where in two days I've spent $2000.00 and when they cater to my needs I report it as it is. When they screw up I report it too. You are working for the mystery shopping company who has an obligation to report the truth to the client. The client has hired us to report ALL our findings. Listen if everything was great eventually the client wouldn't use the mystery shopping company. These reports are used as training for employees valuable information for the client to see what is good and what isn't so good. Telling a customer that charcoal is available then making you pay to rent a bike, pay for the charcoal and waste your valuable time is totally unacceptable. Believe me I'd have names, dates, times. Act like this is your money. Wouldn't a customer be annoyed if this happened to them!

For $525.00 a night, a bike, charcoal, and a massage should ALL be included and YOU should NOT have to pay for anything else, if it wasn't there(charcoal) when you go there, THE HOTEL should have got it for you!!

This is the Hamptons were talking about, not a family resort in the Catskills. ANY hotel out there is expected to provide immpeccable service. Even upscale coverted camps like Rus&!/.r's! Think about it -- the owners spent a fortune in renovations and bringing upscale chefs from Manhatten to the tip of Long Island. The fact that they are not booked solid for the summer in "shares", (by the end of May,) tells you that the service is an issue.

Those very picky up and comers work M-F in the NYC office, dreaming about their Hampton weekend getaway. They go and then return to work in Manhatten, telling all their coworkers, what problems they had to deal with. This in turn has the owners contacting your company and the shopper order is placed. Tell it like it was and in explicit detail.

I'm with Lisa and KR. If any hotel told me there was charcoal provided when I called, and then they dropped that on me, I would be pretty upset. Way over mildly perturbed. I would tell them I came here with grillables and expected to relax and grill my dinner. I was told they had charcoal or I would have brought my own. I would tell them I fully expected them to have it within the hour. AND I would have been super nitty-picky for everything else I had to put on my report, after that shenanigan. Bike down to the store..sheesh!

I have no prob w/the biking because I love to do it anyway & it is great exercise. I have a problem w/grilling my own food. That is work to me. Hamburgers & hot dogs does not sound very Hamptons to me. I would expect steaks & lobsters.

I agree with Crickett. I have stayed in hotels and resorts all over the world, some well over $500 a night. I don't care if I paid $50 orv.$500+. If I asked at the time I booked a room if a service or coonvenience or item were available and found out it was not when I arrived, I would be annoyed. My first comment would be, I was told it was when I called to make my reservation. That is when the "owning" the problem kicks in. No matter whether or not I was incorrectly informed, the staff should do what they can to remedy the situation or offer me something else to compensate for the a absence of the first. It should be done graciously, politely, and immediately. Being there as a mystery shopper in no way changes my expectation or evaluation of their performance.

You were told they had charcoal, you got there; they did not. And it was suggested you rent a bike to go get some? I don't think so! No question but the hotel failed miserably and that should be reported.