Let me start by saying that I have had more good experiences than bad with Intelli!!! However? Yesterday I posted here in defense of them and then woke up this morning to 2 graded reports with low grades due to my grammatical errors...

I did not write these reports any different than the other 80+ reports I've written for this company... I don't mind a low grade here or there, even when I know it shouldn't be that low and I did not make the mistake... But what got me, and what I wanted to ask about, is the comment that I added too many spaces after each sentence...

--> Shop Grade: 8

Comments: Thank you for your report. It has been finalized and a score of 8 was given. There were a few punctuation and formatting errors throughout the report. For example, she stated "yes we do." should be, she stated, "Yes we do." Extra spaces were put between the sentences throughout the entire report. For future reports please be sure to check for theses errors. Thanks again for your time and hard work. Have a great day.

-->Shop Grade: 7

Comments: Thank you for your report. It has been finalized and a score of 7 was given. There were punctuation errors throughout the entire report. For example, he stated "yes, we sure do", should be, he stated, "Yes, we sure do." Also, there were extra spaces put between every sentence throughout the entire report. Please be sure to correct these errors in the future before submitting your report. Thanks again for your time and hard work. Have a great day.


I cannot remember how I wrote the quotes so I let that part go... But I add 2 spaces after every sentence, as I have for 15+ years of keyboarding... Did I miss something? I'm not sure my fingers would be putting more than that after each sentence... Are the editors native English speakers??

Again, I'm very pleased with this MSC and this is only the 2nd run in with the editors where I don't agree with them (the other being the time they asked me how I got a name when I clearly put it in the report and then simply hitting submit without changing anything and then being marked down because they had to contact me...). I care about the quality of my work. Am I missing something?

No, you're not missing something. Whether there's one space or two after the period at the end of the sentence is a style question. Most older people use two spaces, which is what we were taught. The newer style is one space. I'd pay those two grades no mind at all. You've run across an editor who who feels insecure and thinks it's his/her job to find something wrong. As to whether the company's editors are picky, "yes, they sure are."

I was always taught 2 spaces, but the "new" way is 1 space. I have been only using 1 space in shop reports, because they give you no room to write and I can conserve a few characters. For what it's worth, I prefer 2 spaces when reading. It's easier on the eyes and the breaks in thoughts are clearer. I have no idea why the "new" way is suppose to be better!

Please tell me the word "Grammer" in the title was a joke ....

When I was an editor for ACL, we were instructed to change the shopper reports to two spaces in between sentences, though shoppers were not dinged for using one space since both are correct. That's just the way ACL wanted their shops sent to the client. Ardent didn't care either way if the reports went to the client with one or two in between sentences. As a shopper, I always use two spaces in between sentences and have never been dinged for it.

Service Check is another MSC that wants only one space.

I have never heard of the single space rule and I always use 2 after punctuation. I've never been dinged for it. As both of those reports were clearly the same editor, I wouldn't worry about it too much as it isn't likely to affect much. The editor is correct about the capitalization in the quotes.

I haven't done anything for Service Check in a very long time (maybe three years?) but I always used spaces and always got 10s (except for one 8, and it wasn't because of spaces in between sentences) on my shops. I wonder if this is something new or if they just have new editors who are super picky?

Some companies don't care if it is one or two spaces as long as it is consistent. One space is the new standard and expectation. I am still training my fingers to put one space. Search and replace is useful for checking myself.

Am I correct in thinking their first example wasn't quite right either? Shouldn't there be a comma after "yes," as they did in the second example?

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/27/2016 05:50PM by Threemom.

I hate this new "one space" rule. I've been typing for over 50 years -- and it's very, very true that it's hard to teach "old dogs" new tricks!!!!!!!!!!!!

When typewriters ruled the world, there were always two spaces after a period.Typewriters had fixed-width fonts, so the two spaces made it easier, visually, to separate the sentences. Now with proportional-width fonts, the two spaces at the end of a sentence became unnecessary. I wasn't aware that it was "wrong" to use two spaces. It's usually seen as a matter of style. Intelli should put their style preferences in their guidelines if they are going to mark down for it.

[Okay. Twice today I had a Bubba flashback. This (two spaces vs one) was one of his pet peeves. And beginning a sentence with "and" was another. Anyone else?]

I was taught two spaces and have always used two spaces in my reports. The companies I shop for have never mentioned this. I'm to old to change now.

My wife is an attorney and a partner in a legal firm. This exact topic has come up (Yes, pretty boring topic!). They (the law profession) usually put one space after a period. However, at least two grammar checkers put two spaces after a period. Both are acceptable. I think that editor has reached a critical breaking point in her mental state.....par for the course with Intelli-shop employees.

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/27/2016 06:05PM by winemaker.

This scares me. I shop with Intellishop and have always, ALWAYS used two spaces after a period. If one of their editors ding me for it in the future, I might reconsider doing reports for them, because it would be too hard for me to switch to one.

As Chris stated, we don't need two spaces with computers. The programs make the adjustment for us (though they never told us).

That the comments were nearly identical says to me that your editor was lazy, and she was simply cutting and pasting.

The first correction from the editor should have been, she stated, "Yes, we do." She omitted the comma so the editor should be dinged for her feedback. I'm getting ready to do my report for Customer Service Expert for a storage shop. Their guidelines specifically required two spaces after each period. Service Check is another MSC that are really anal about their reports.

I just got another one - probably from the same editor... This time I got a 9 and it states I had grammatical and punctuation issues... Again, I've done 100+ reports the same way without issues on maybe 1% of them and now it seems every one... So frustrated with this editor.

Does anyone know of a great spell check and grammer check to buy. I know my reports can use the help some times. I have one but it is not very good.

@Alieda wrote:

Does anyone know of a great spell check and grammer check to buy. I know my reports can use the help some times. I have one but it is not very good.

try grammarly (i use the free version and it works well...it gives suggestions, etc and it highlighted 3 of yours ...it highlighted a misspelled word and a possibly miswritten word as well as a punctuation error: grammer is misspelled, the first sentence is a question and ends with a period and not a queston mark and "some times" perhaps should be "some time".

i'm not being critical but just giving a grammar checking program suggestion. my operating system (windows 10) has a very good built-in spell check. i rarely capitalize (except in doing reports) because i'm a very fast typer (typist?) and it works for me.

Well. I'm glad the MS company that I edit for does not grade on grammar, spelling and writing style. I never say anything to shoppers about writing errors. That is what I am there for, to clean up the typos and mis-spellings. Also, I disagree with the feedback that editor sent you. ( I'm a teacher during the day). It should actually be, "Yes. We do." Spacing style is not important, as long as it is consistent throughout the writing. If you ask me, that company is just plain rude.

@ChrisCooper wrote:

When typewriters ruled the world, there were always two spaces after a period.Typewriters had fixed-width fonts, so the two spaces made it easier, visually, to separate the sentences. Now with proportional-width fonts, the two spaces at the end of a sentence became unnecessary. I wasn't aware that it was "wrong" to use two spaces. It's usually seen as a matter of style. Intelli should put their style preferences in their guidelines if they are going to mark down for it.

[Okay. Twice today I had a Bubba flashback. This (two spaces vs one) was one of his pet peeves. And beginning a sentence with "and" was another. Anyone else?]

Starting a sentence with "and" is incorrect I believe. A sentence beginning with "and" should actually be preceded by the previous sentence and sometimes a comma.

Mozilla has a built-in spell check feature. I use it frequently when writing my report narratives.

With Service Sleuth, it all depends on the editor. I know I would get a 9 even if there is almost no commentary required because she does not give a 10. And, word for word, the same evaluation, from one report to the next. One time I asked why and she told me because I wrote this way and that. I told her I had a copy of every report and that was not my writing style. The next time with her, I got a 10. Then back to 9 and then I was even told I was docked 1 because I was late. I wrote back I was not late but I never received an answer. The other editors seemed to have no problem giving me a 10. Now I just don't care.

I thought dropping from two spaces to one at the end of a sentence had more to do with limited storage space on older hard drives in the early days of computers. Everyone looked for shortcuts to save space. Does anyone remember the Y2K predictions? In their zeal to save on expensive storage space, programmers had begun entering a year as two digits instead of four. There were predictions of widespread power outages and banking system failures based on this. Most large companies scrambled from 1998 to 2000 to fix these programming problems before 12/31/1999. Everyone stayed up until midnight on New Year's Eve to see of the electricity would stay on.

@vlh1234h wrote:

Starting a sentence with "and" is incorrect I believe. A sentence beginning with "and" should actually be preceded by the previous sentence and sometimes a comma.

More or less, it depends on the sentence itself.

[www.dailywritingtips.com]

One space is the common writing standard and has been for many years. (I learned two spaces back in the day, too!) Some MSCs still want two, but I think using one is generally acceptable and accepted in reports, unless the MSC states in its guidelines that it requires two. I work with one that does, and I think it's because the software program "reads" one space as no space. I don't think shoppers should be marked down on spacing unless the MSC specifically says to use one or the other. That's unfair.

The editor who reviewed your reports was partly right and partly wrong on the other comment. Always use the vocative comma. Which the editor didn't do in the first example. That comma seems to be a disappearing species, but it's required. Every time there's a direct address in a sentence, a comma (or semi-colon in some cases) is needed. E.g., "Hi; how may I help you?" or "Happy Birthday, John." Your "yes we do" should have the Y capitalized, since it was the beginning of her sentence, and a comma after "yes." You could have written "Yes, we do." Or made it into two sentences. A comma, in this case, is most commonly used. HTH!

And it's not wrong to start a sentence with "and," "but," etc. The "rule" about not starting a sentence with a conjunction is bunk. I'd avoid it in very formal writing, but it's commonly accepted and effective in marketing writing and conversational writing.

Of course, this doesn't cover the times when the shopper is right, and the editor is wrong. Which happens, too. (I just got marked down for not capitalizing "team member." Which should not be capitalized.

I wish MSCs would give us a style guide to follow, either an in-house guide, or suggest either Chicago or AP. It would make our lives easier.



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 10/29/2016 02:12PM by BirdyC.

@JASFLALMT wrote:

Mozilla has a built-in spell check feature. I use it frequently when writing my report narratives.

I never knew that!! I use Mozilla, and would be interested in knowing how to access this feature. TIA!

Guysmom, if you are misspelling a word when using Mozilla, it will automatically underline it in red. You never noticed that? You must be spelling everything correctly Try this: open Mozilla and compose an email. Deliberately misspell a few words and you will notice that they are underlined in red! Or, next time you write a narrative in a shop report using Mozilla, deliberately misspell a word--it should underline it in red and then you can change it.