@JASFLALMT - I'm sorry, but your last post is ridiculous.

One of the most basic tenets of mystery shopping is that the guidelines of any projects must be followed and any deviation from the guidelines can result in rejection of the shop. This is an accepted part of the industry and certainly not limited to Sentry. Any person who has been shopping for any length of time should be aware of this because it is part of most assignment guidelines.

Our guidelines include the statement:

- Conduct the shop exactly as directed in these instructions.
- - You may not modify any part of the scenario or instructions. If you elect to do so, you risk your report being rejected.

Nonetheless, you think this situation is our fault because we didn't spell out that asking for an item other than what is listed in the guidelines may result in rejection. You also think that we should pay shoppers who asked for an Indoor Heater vs. an Outdoor Heater. I'm sorry but if you believe this, you are either intellectual dishonest or not as experienced as you claim.

We all understand your great love for the fan favorite on this forum. I think hero worship is really interesting considering that company has many assignments that pay reimbursement only with requirements in excess of Sentry projects. We get it, you love them because they love their shoppers and never do anything wrong. I wonder, in your former life as an MSC editors, how many shoppers got paid after posting about heir issue on social media. My bet is ZERO. In my shopping career, I had shops rejected for reasons I thought were BS. As an owner, I see things differently.

The fact is that Sentry, while not a perfect company, is honest and transparent. We may not always get it right, but we do try to do the right thing. Some may not like how we handled this situation and that is ok. We've paid out plenty in goodwill including assignments that were not performed correctly and shops rejected by clients where we did not agree with the rejection.

This thread is a perfect example of how off the rails some forum members have become. The pettiness has reached a new low and frankly, I think it is very sad and makes the industry look less legit.

I'm done discussing this now. I am going to say a prayer for everyone impacted by the terrible events in Florida and spend tomorrow morning trying to find a home for four code red dogs that are running out time.

Indoor heaters? No, the OP asked for a patio heater. Patios are outside.

Just because I enjoy working for IPSOS, Alta 360, and many other MSCs hardly counts as fan favorites or hero worship, LOL.

Oh, BTW, I still think if you spent half as much time tending to your company and updating guidelines to make them clear as you do obsessing over this forum, you would have fewer problems with things of this nature.

I'm not sure if it is intentional or not, but you keep obscuring the fact that only one shopper asked for Patio Heater instead of Outdoor Heater. 1 shopper out of 489. 2 shops out of 778. More shoppers made the mistake of asking for an Indoor Heater despite the guidelines clearly requiring an Outdoor Heater.

You are well aware of the company I am referring to as your "fan favorite", however, none of the companies you listed is singled out of criticism the same way Sentry is by you and others on this forum. Your obsessive need to post and criticize Sentry speaks loudly about your bias. Your cheap shot about updating the guidelines didn't go unnoticed either.

On a more positive note, it looks like foster families have been found for two of the dogs. Two to go.

@JASFLALMT wrote:

Indoor heaters? No, the OP asked for a patio heater. Patios are outside.

Just because I enjoy working for IPSOS, Alta 360, and many other MSCs hardly counts as fan favorites or hero worship, LOL.

There are a lot of indoor patios and sunrooms. [www.houzz.com]
Either way I agree that Sentry is wasting their time since trying and proving the shopper didn't follow the instructions. They should just pay all shoppers even if they cannot read the instructions. I thought as independent contractors it was up to us to follow the information set by the client but I guess we can just do it however we want and still get paid according to some of these posts

Since everyone seems to love this thread, maybe we can put it to good use. If you are in the DFW area, please consider helping:

Sentry Marketing Group is proud to work with Passport for Paws. Passport for Paws Is a non-profit 501 (c) (3) organization that focuses on rescuing code red dogs from local area shelters. Code red dogs are in danger of being euthanized due to overcrowding.

We are reaching out to the mysteryshopforum shopper community because Passport for Paws is looking for assistance in locating families to foster or rescue. For fostering, the average stay is 2 to 25 days. There are four dogs in our area that can be saved if foster parents are found TODAY ASAP.

If you are interested, please contact Briana at Wedel.briana@gmail.com or Brittany at Zimlichb@gmail.com for more information.

Thank you,

Team Sentry

isaiah58

I READ THE thREAD- every chapter
My question remains
it COULD have been solved with one easy email

@isaiah58 wrote:

@CANADAMOMMY wrote:

So if the report said buy a pop and I bought a pop but in the report I said I bought a soda would the editor email me and ask me what I bought or presume it was the same item? My point many posts ago was editors DO contact the shopper for clarification. Why not do it in this case? Would my report be denied because I did not say the word pop but said the word soda when 99% of us understand it IS the same thing.

Please read the thread. The shopper was to ask for something specific in a specific way. They did not describe something they saw, but provided a quote of the question they asked. I had a report for another MSC rejected because I provided quotes and they said I did not ask for the item as directed. Since then I developed better ways to properly ask for specific items. Even above, the OP continues to twist words even though they clearly made a demand, which in the thread several members advised was not appropriate.

I'm surprised that so many people here have, on other threads with the same issue, said too bad you didn't follow the guidelines so you don't get paid. What has frequently been added has been "well, maybe mystery shopping is not for you".

This forum, as a conglomerate, has reinforced the controversial issue of not getting paid when you don't follow the guidelines to the T. Yet, in some cases "this" happens. I can't figure it out anymore than I can figure out why the mods demonize some people who respond to negative posters, especially the ones who attack others, but don't attribute the origination to the originator. It's like having a parent who can't make up their minds.

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/15/2018 03:44PM by spicy1.

What is DFW?

Dallas, Fort Worth

The definition of a patio is :
an area, usually paved, adjoining a house and used as an area for outdoor lounging, dining, etc.​

@CANADAMOMMY wrote:

So if the report said buy a pop and I bought a pop but in the report I said I bought a soda would the editor email me and ask me what I bought or presume it was the same item? My point many posts ago was editors DO contact the shopper for clarification. Why not do it in this case? Would my report be denied because I did not say the word pop but said the word soda when 99% of us understand it IS the same thing.

I grew up with the word pop sometimes being used for soda but still I am obviously in the 1%. If someone wrote they bought a pop and reported that it could also mean they bought an ice pop or ice cream pop. The receipt would show which one was purchased and if they purchased the correct one then just changing the wording of the report makes it okay. But this comparison is apples to oranges. You are comparing someone asking for the incorrect item to someone using the wrong word in the report but doing the shop correctly. For example you are to go to the used car dealer and ask what cars they have for sale in a certain $$ range and instead you ask which Toyotas they have in that category. The narrower interpretation did not give the salesperson the chance to expand their knowledge on the whole topic or to ask questions to narrow down the search which experienced shoppers know is often what the job is looking for. Personally I do not take shops where I am unfamiliar with the item we are supposed to ask about unless I google it first to make sure. The OP may very well have assumed they knew what an outdoor heater was and that it was only including patio heaters. But since the word OUTDOOR was capitalized in the report it certainly would have made me stop and think....why is this word capitalized? I live in Southern California and to me what came to mind for outdoor heaters were fire pits often used in an open yard for an outdoor "winter" party. But I would not have asked about patio heaters or fire pits since I was supposed to ask for the general category.
I have worked for Sentry, granted just a little bit as they do not have lots of jobs I want, but I have never had any issues with them.

@Sentry Marketing wrote:

You are well aware of the company I am referring to as your "fan favorite", however, none of the companies you listed is singled out of criticism the same way Sentry is by you and others on this forum. Your obsessive need to post and criticize Sentry speaks loudly about your bias.

[/quote]

Currently my favorite MSCs are IPSOS and Alta Research.

I find it hypocritical of you to use the word obsessive regarding me, LOL. The seven lengthy, unsolicited PMs you have sent me over the past two days about this thread, especially after I asked you to not PM me anymore, now that's obsessive!! I was not biased against your company, Dave, but I am pretty annoyed with you as a person, mostly because of your constant PMs after I told you not to PM me anymore, which borderlines harassment. Also how you dug through the old forum posts to get enough information, then sifted through your database to find out who I am in real life, and post that you know who I am as if...what, some sort of intimidation tactic? Or as a power play to scare any shoppers who are signed up with your company not to breathe the wrong way or you might deactivate them?

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/15/2018 09:13PM by JASFLALMT.

I agree. This thread and SoCalMa threatening threads to find out who posters are to eliminate them as a shopper are repulsive.

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/15/2018 09:21PM by RoutedNotOuted.

I have no idea what SoCalMama did that you are talking about?

@JASFLALMT

There are few things that bother me more than intellectual dishonesty. Your characterization of our PM conversation is completely misleading. You replied seven times and at no time did you ask that I stop PMing you.

You know that I am aware of your identity because emailed me directly for help with a password issue several years ago. At that time, all communication between you and our team was very, very pleasant. Your attempt to mischaracterize our offline conversation and the reason I am aware of your identity would seem to violate the posting guidelines of this forum. The members of the mysteryshopforum community deserve better.

In no way have I tired to intimidate you. I think many people could interpret your posting inaccurate statements as your attempt to intimidate or bully me. I'm sorry that you don't like being help accountable for posting untruthful statements. Your lack of precision seems to be an ongoing issue.

From: JASFLALMT To: Sentry Marketing 02/06/2018 01:49PM
I wasn't always biased against your company, but the over the last year every time I read your posts I changed my stance. Please don't PM me anymore. If you have something to say, do so publicly.

Google definitely isn't exactly an infallible source, Lisa. I just so happened to have been in a Home Depot picking up stuff, and asked a manager what the differences were. What he showed and explained gave me a better understanding of the similarities and differences were to each product.

Yet for the sake of argument, I see quite a bit of vitriol against Dave not necessarily for the highly probable answer as to why the OP had their shop failed. I think the backlash from many people on this thread is mainly due to something personal against Dave, and that's just wrong. Say what you will about him from past threads, yet I actually find the client's reasoning as to why the shop was rejected to be perfectly sound. Patio heaters and outdoor heaters are not the same, and the OP mistakenly used both concept and terminology incorrectly in what the guidelines stated. If OP had said that an anesthesiologist and a neurosurgeon was the same thing in a similar shop reporting scenario, they would still be wrong despite both are doctors, yet with different skill sets.

@LisaSTL wrote:

Eric, that is why I asked the question earlier, like on the first damn page of this thread. A simple Google search using each term returned basically the same results. You have to admit there is a certain lack of logic attached to considering a "patio" heater for use indoors. At least there is in my mind. In reality, I don't give a rat's hiney other than I have considered some heaters for my own patio. You know how much I love to hang out there when the weather permits. Otherwise the question goes back to what MFJ just posted, were the guidelines clear the specific terms needed to be used? We all make fun of redundant guidelines, but you have to admit there is a need for them sometimes

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/15/2018 10:19PM by Eric in Tampa.

My problem is and I am a bystander without a grudge, not having worked for Sentry in 10 years, but...the behavior between Dave and a couple shoppers is juvenile. I get it, they want an OUTDOOR heater, not a PATIO heater. Dave being correct disenables himself with this continued conversation, knowing what he wants/needs for the report, just re-do the shop with the same shopper and call it a day. Pages of fighting doesn't help his company or the shoppers as far as other MSC's viewing this nonsense...moving forward.....

Yeah, it was my mistake to respond to any further PMs after I asked him to stop.

@Sentry Marketing wrote:

@JASFLALMT
You know that I am aware of your identity because emailed me directly for help with a password issue several years ago.

I did not reach out to you for a password issue through this forum, and I did not identify myself in the email as a forum member, which means you did some digging and sleuthing to link my forum identity to your database. I am sure you found reference in the forum (by digging through many, many posts) what region I lived in, then using my initials and going through your shopper database, it was time consuming but wasn't too difficult for you to put two and two together. You have far too much time on your hands.

When I read some of Dave’s posts I think of this “Projection is a defense mechanism used to displace responsibility of one’s negative behavior and traits by attributing them to someone else. It ultimately acts as a digression that avoids ownership and accountability.”

However, sometimes people are forced to appear as though they are projecting by defending themselves through absolute absurdity. As in this case.

I get it too, Irene. Some shoppers are mad at Dave based on past history. Yet I also have to put myself in his shoes as business owner too. If someone was slandering my company + self with questionable facts, I'd be a little confrontational, sure. That's why I don't understand the constant dogpiling comments on him + the company. If you don't like either, don't accept shops! Its that simple.

@JASFLALMT

In 2016, you emailed me directly to ask for help resetting your password and you revealed your forum identity to me. That's it. No research, no analysis, no reading of your posts, nothing nefarious. The precision issues continue.

Now why in the world would I have done that? I don't recall doing so and it would make no sense for me to have done that, given the circumstances.

I wouldn't stoop this low coming onto a forum and fighting and possibly making more enemies with would be shoppers. When one hits low, I go high!!

Nope, just you and just because of your attitude.

Eric, I asked the question early on because I was curious. It was long before we were subjected to post after post from Dave trying to prove he was right AND he knew who Shoppers were despite their otherwise anonymous screen names. I never suggested Google was infallible and by your own admission it took asking the question at a retailer to understand the difference. You were right about my feelings toward Dave. It is hard not to dislike someone who always has a vendetta, tries to intimidate people and harasses members with unwanted PMs.

Spicy, personally I haven’t suggested the OP be paid if there was an error so I am consistent. My question all along by was if the guidelines were clear or vague. If they were clear, of course she would not be paid. If they were vague and could be misinterpreted we enter that gray area.

@Sentry Marketing wrote:

@LisaSTL - there are plenty of other forum members that we've helped over the years. Your sarcasm demonstrates your bias against Sentry and me/quote]

Equal rights for others does not mean fewer rights for you. It's not pie.
"I prefer someone who burns the flag and then wraps themselves up in the Constitution over someone who burns the Constitution and then wraps themselves up in the flag." -Molly Ivins
Never try to teach a pig to sing. It's a waste of your time and it really annoys the pig.

So tonight we are having 1.5 inch T-bone steaks with sauteed asparagus and garlic bread. I make my garlic bread using roasted garlic, butter, and sea salt on Ciabatta bread. I know that we won't finish these steaks, LOL, they are huge! We will have steak sandwiches tomorrow night, Philly Cheesesteak style, and then the bones will go in the crockpot for a day or two for a pasta sauce.

I make my own bone broth. We buy joints and leg bones from local beef/dairy farm that is also a conservation. The black Angus are grass fed and finished, no hormones, etc used. I roast the bones which makes the broth more flavorful plus helps the broth gell better. We use a crock pot, about 36 hours on slow.

They also offer pretty much any cut you can think of.